Monday, July 18, 2011

We've Pretty Much Established That Orthodox Judaism Is Not Suited For Employed Singles

Normally I probably would have given JRKmommy the usual treatment but I gave it a break this time because she was learning that everything she valued as cutting edge shit was really a whole lot of bull shit. This is not an easy experience.

JRKmommy has utterly failed to establish how practicing orthodox judaism benefits employed singles. When you are an employed single and you practice orthodox judaism, you benefit the religion without it benefiting you.

The kasharut rabbis get your money. The synagogue gets your money on high holidays (disallowed to do business on high holidays!). Talking to girls and dating girls gets discouraged or disallowed. And what do you get in return for all your troubles of paying $$$$$ to keep kosher and not having Saturday free? For all your sacrifice? RULES!!!!!!!!!!! The reward for following the rules is having the rules to follow. The Orthodox can also cut the shit about Hashem because the reform jews are richer than the orthodox jews.

- work provides enough structure we don't need strict religion + work to provide structure. However, if you don't have work then strict religion can be of help to give structure.

- Orthodox Judaism does not make you more moral. Do you need a whole gemarah to not bother anyone? not call names or talk crap about people? etc. Orthodox Judaism is about social engineering and self propagation, not about making people more moral.

When you are unemployed yes the talmud can keep you busy, but when you are employed, you wanna do your own stuff.

Oh and also, you can be individualistically spiritual. Orthodox Judaism does not have a monopoly on spirituality.

There are also other types of communities besides religious communities.

Ultimately you have to have the strength, courage, and knowledge to balance the two extremes of hedonism and asceticism in a way that you are comfortable with, and to self actualize in your own way.

There is no compelling reason for an employed single to practice orthodox judaism.


JRKmommy said...

Sorry, I thought that you may have responded in a more grown-up tone because you wanted to act more like a mentch than a douche. My bad.

I wasn't trying to "sell" you on Orthodox Judaism at all. You want to focus on "what's in it for me?" and have no real interest in contributing to the community or doing the hard work involved in focusing on your own conduct. I was pretty clear that Orthodox Judaism (or any other stream of Judaism that I know) ISN'T about non-stop fun and does focus on mitzvot and community.

I mean, it costs nothing to borrow a copy of the Chofetz Chaim or any basic Artscroll book on proper ways to treat people. Plenty of non-religious people also manage to figure out how to treat others decently. You aren't willing to put in the effort.

Maybe I should turn the question around. Why would Orthodox Judaism want you?

SJ said...

Ok JRK, how does avoiding pork make you more moral? XD How does not touching pennies on Shabbat make you more moral? XD

>> no real interest in contributing to the community

Religion is supposed to make lives better for people. It's not to make life as hard as possible for people with nothing in return.

>> ISN'T about non-stop fun

Agreed that life isn't just about fun. That's not the issue. Life isn't about non-stop seriousness. I mean, WTF, wearing white shirts and black pants business attire on a 24/7 basis? Gimme a break.

>> Maybe I should turn the question around. Why would Orthodox Judaism want you?

If you think that I am the only one with these kinds of concerns you are kidding yourself, hence the whole OTD movement.

Eli said...

I think most OJs (at least male OJs) would concede that they do it becuase it's "The truth", and that the OJ life is harder ("shver tzu zein a yid").

ksil said...

to me, its very simple.

if one has a desire to live a life with meaning, with a purpose, orthodox judaism is a good choice for many reasons.

first, its how I (we) grew up. we know it, we are familiar with it (boo hoo, i can eat pork). familiarity is comfort.

second, the focus on family and community. children, schools, education, hatzalah, shuls, gatherings, bar mitzvahs...these social interactions are lovely. (and if you are traveling to india or peru or peurto rico you can get kosher food and a minyan, how nice is that? community)

many many more