Friday, July 22, 2011

JRKmommy Nasty Comment About Christianity

Media hype?? In Catholicism, priest-penitent confidentiality is staunchly defended. That's a basic fact. There's no theological requirement to confess one's sins to anyone other than the priest in order to receive forgiveness, and a priest who breaks confidentiality can be ex-communicated. Read up on basic Christian theology. Most of the evangelical movements teach that salvation doesn't come from works, but from grace through faith. See Ephesians 2:8: http://bible.cc/ephesians/2-8.htm In particular, this was the doctrine put forth by Luther as part of the Protestant reformation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sola_fide Ask an evangelical Christian 2 questions: 1. What happened to the souls of Jews murdered in the Holocaust? 2. What would have happened to the soul of a Nazi who killed Jews, who subsequently found faith in Jesus?


>> Media hype?? In Catholicism, priest-penitent confidentiality is staunchly defended. That's a basic fact. There's no theological requirement to confess one's sins to anyone other than the priest in order to receive forgiveness, and a priest who breaks confidentiality can be ex-communicated. Read up on basic Christian theology. Most of the evangelical movements teach that salvation doesn't come from works, but from grace through faith. See Ephesians 2:8: http://bible.cc/ephesians/2-8.htm In particular, this was the doctrine put forth by Luther as part of the Protestant reformation:

JRKmommy only gives half the equation for being saved in both Catholicism and Protestantism. Both brands of Christianity require faith AND good works they just say it differently. Catholicism just says faith and good works are required. Protestantism gives a more elaborate explanation and says that being saved is free upon believing but good works are required to be obedient. Practically though it's the same thing.


-> 1. What happened to the souls of Jews murdered in the Holocaust?

There are christians who believe that the jews need to believe in Jesus to be saved and there are those who don't. I don't believe that the jews need to believe in Jesus to be saved.

Secondly, if someone gets killed by a jew, does that person automatically go to heaven or is he judged individually? Of course he's judged individually so asking what happens to the souls of jews murdered in the holocaust is just nastyness.


>> 2. What would have happened to the soul of a Nazi who killed Jews, who subsequently found faith in Jesus?

Matthew 7:21-23 says "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."

I highly doubt that JRK would be so nasty as to suggest that nazism and the holocaust is within the will of Jesus Christ.

Also there's Hebrews 10:26-27 "If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God." I'm pretty sure that the nazis were aware that God don't appreciate murder. This also refutes any suggestion that Christianity just lets you do what ever you want and ask for forgiveness after like it's a game.

7 comments:

JRKmommy said...

Some of what I've read on Protestantism does suggest that if a person is saved, they would want to please Jesus and that fact that they do good works would be a sign of this. There doesn't seem to be an expectation that people will succeed in totally avoiding sin, which seems to be viewed as an impossible standard.

My question, though, was about what would happen to someone who had committed huge sins against other people - such as a Nazi - who subsequently embraced Jesus.

Your answer is basically that they would need not to deliberately keep sinning after they were saved. It doesn't say anything about the sins already committed.

There's nothing, though, that requires that person to specifically seek forgiveness from their victims.

In my interfaith discussions, 2 main differences between Christianity and Judaism stick out:

1. There's a very clear distinction between the emphasis places on faith vs. works. In Christian, faith takes precedence, and in Judaism it's works.

2. In Judaism, there is no forgiveness of sins between you and others without seeking the forgiveness of the person you wronged.

JRKmommy said...

Interesting article on method of forgiveness in Judaism, with an added point about your "employed singles" question:

http://www.torah.org/learning/mlife/LORch2-9.html?print=1

SJ said...

JRK, cut it out. There may be groups that deemphasize works but it runs counter to what the New Testament says which REQUIRES works so stop trying to lawyer at me with bull shit I'm getting close to getting tired of it and you are about to push me over the edge.

And again JRK, you fail in suggesting that apologizing to other people is not necessary in Christianity.


James 5:16 "Therefore, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great power as it is working."

Anonymous said...

@ SGay:

Out of curiousity, now that you claim to have fully made the transition from Judaism to Christianity, you have yet to indicate a strain of Christianity. (There's no such thing as "just Christian!") What's this about Catholicism versus Protestantism? It seems to me that you fall into the conservative-Protestant (Charismatic, Evangelical, Fundamentalist, Pentecostal, etc.) spectrum. If I recall, you would get your panties in a bunch whenever someone would call you an Evangelical. So have you found a denomination or are you still confused?

SJ said...

>> have you found a denomination

no need for you to know.

Anonymous said...

Of course there's no need or reason for me to know, SJ. I was just curious. Did you pursue Christianity because you sincerely sought the "right" religion, or simply just because you hate Judaism and wanted to rebel. If the latter, then the issue is moot. If the former, I'm curious how you would go about identifying the correct denomination/sect given the plethora of strains of Christianity. (Unless you are starting your own church. But good luck attracting membership!)

SJ said...

It's not about sects it's about God and what the Bible says.